[차한잔] [잡담] 레이건에 대한 어느 미국인 과의 대화 2.
재경이 삼촌
526
2005-08-13 14:28:37
이번 대화 상대자는 Dave (54), 한때는 공화당 지지자
였지만, 부시가 싫어서 지난번 선거때는 케리를 지지 했습니다. 하는 일은 프렌즈의 챈들러 하고 비슷한 일에 종사 중이죠(챈들러가 직장 바꾸기
전).
ME: HI
Dave : Hi
ME: have you been?
Dave : I think you needed to put a 'how' before that question?
ME: yes
ME: sorry
ME: I have a question, sir
Dave : busy with work... that's for sure..
Dave : and that question would be?
ME: DO you think Reagan was a good president?
ME: Especially when it comes to Economy
Dave : Depends....
Dave : was there waste in the government, yes...
ME: Take for example...Firing all those workers at the airport who were on strike
Dave : the biggest reason Reagan beat Carter was that Carter tried to lecture the people instead of leading them...
Dave : He fired the air traffic controllers who went on strike, they were federal employees, barred from striking...
Dave : so they went on a strike, he fired them!
ME: oh, they were federal employess...and can I take them as public office workers?
Dave : at the time Reagan was elected, we had run away inflation in this country... interest rates on mortgages were over 10%
ME: wow
Dave : I used to get 4.20 an hour in cost of living adjustment pay because prices were going up that fast
Dave : that $4.20 was on top of my regular hourly rate
ME: that means you got extra 4.20 for each hour?
Dave : yes
Dave : the people like a strong leader, not a leader who is right....
ME: that's a lot. you know minimum wage in wisconsin per hour nowadays is 5.70
Dave : look at this last election... they portrayed Kerry as weak, even tho he was correct...
Dave : yes.. I know
Dave : Had Carter got a handle on the economy as well as got the hostages out of Iran, he would have won..
ME: then, I can say that people used to get more hourly payment than now?
Dave : well remember I was a union employee... UAW at that time
ME: UAW?
Dave : United Auto Workers
ME: and I did not know that you were in union
ME: ah, I see
Dave : I was working for Case in the factory in those days...
ME: Are you saying that non UAW members got less than UAWs?
Dave : if you worked in the factory in those days as an hourly employee, you had to be a union member...
ME: ah, ok
Dave : did the workers at McDonald's get that 4.20 per hour more, NO
ME: Well, the reason why I am asking you this question is...There was a strike of airline pilots in Korea
ME: There are two airline companies in Korea Korean Air, and Asiana...
ME: Asiana's pilots went on strike, and they became public enemy all of a sudden. People think, those pilots are not allowed to strike, as long as they earn more than ordinary Korean workers, and especially not on holiday seasons!
Dave : if they are unionized and not employed by the government of S. Korea, they certainly have the right to strike.... but in your culture, they are seen as greedy...
ME: That's the thing that I hate...They have every right, and people hate that...Their lame reason "for the sake of public and nation", my ass
Dave : for what sake of the public? and for the nation?? If everyone makes more, they spend more and more people work
ME: And Mass media started to use the anecdote of Reagan's firing aircontrol workers.
Dave : totally different situation
Dave : doubt if there are many reporters in the mass media in Korea who actually were living through those days here in the USA
ME: They said, "Look what Reagan did to those workers on Strike!"
Dave : well those workers worked for the federal government.. not a private company
ME: I don't think they lived through that period in the USA, they just read the news, I guess
Dave : and only selective parts of the news at that!
ME: yes, as usual
Dave : well, I need to do a few things... ttyl
ME: ttyl thanks
간략히 요점만 정리하면, 카터를 누르고 레이건이 승리한 이유는 국민이 원하는 "강한모습"으로 어필한 것이 크게 작용했다고 하네요. 또 당시의 경제상황이 심한 인플레로 몸살을 앓았나 봅니다.
그리고, 공항의 관제사들 파업에 대해선 이런 말을 하네요.
연방 직원인 공항 관제사들은 파업이 금지되어있는데(they were federal employees, barred from striking... ), 파업에 돌입했고, 그래서 다 해고를 당한거라고.
제가 짧게 아시아나 파일럿들의 파업에 대해, 그리고 국민의 반응을 말을 해 주었더니, 이렇게 답을 하더군요.
if they are unionized and not employed by the government of S. Korea, they certainly have the right to strike.... but in your culture, they are seen as greedy...
만약 노조조직이 있고, 한국정부에 고용된게 아니면, 분명히 파업할 권리가 있지, 그런데 니네 정서(culture를 이렇게 의역합니다.) 탐욕스럽게 보인거야.
그리고
totally different situation (전혀 다른 상황이지)"
저 개인적으로는, 공공이익을 위해서 파업을 자제해야 한다는 소리엔 콧방귀 뀝니다. 그 말은 "니네들에겐 파업할 권리가 없다"는 말을 두리뭉실 돌려 표현한 것에 지나지 않는다고 생각하고있습니다.
P.S 1 : 미국인들의 실질 소득이 하락하기는 엄청나게 하락 했나 보군요. Dave 가 과거에 자동차 공장에서 일할때 (80년대 초반) 인플레를 감안해서, 시급에 시간당 $4.20을 추가로 받았다고 하니...물론 노조가 있었기에 이것도 가능했나 봅니다. 지금 위스컨신주의 시간당 최저임금은 $5.70 입니다. 한국의 2배에 약간 못미치나요?
P.S 2 : Dave : the people like a strong leader, not a leader who is right....박정희나 전두환에 대한 향수를 설명할 수 있을까요?
ME: HI
Dave : Hi
ME: have you been?
Dave : I think you needed to put a 'how' before that question?
ME: yes
ME: sorry
ME: I have a question, sir
Dave : busy with work... that's for sure..
Dave : and that question would be?
ME: DO you think Reagan was a good president?
ME: Especially when it comes to Economy
Dave : Depends....
Dave : was there waste in the government, yes...
ME: Take for example...Firing all those workers at the airport who were on strike
Dave : the biggest reason Reagan beat Carter was that Carter tried to lecture the people instead of leading them...
Dave : He fired the air traffic controllers who went on strike, they were federal employees, barred from striking...
Dave : so they went on a strike, he fired them!
ME: oh, they were federal employess...and can I take them as public office workers?
Dave : at the time Reagan was elected, we had run away inflation in this country... interest rates on mortgages were over 10%
ME: wow
Dave : I used to get 4.20 an hour in cost of living adjustment pay because prices were going up that fast
Dave : that $4.20 was on top of my regular hourly rate
ME: that means you got extra 4.20 for each hour?
Dave : yes
Dave : the people like a strong leader, not a leader who is right....
ME: that's a lot. you know minimum wage in wisconsin per hour nowadays is 5.70
Dave : look at this last election... they portrayed Kerry as weak, even tho he was correct...
Dave : yes.. I know
Dave : Had Carter got a handle on the economy as well as got the hostages out of Iran, he would have won..
ME: then, I can say that people used to get more hourly payment than now?
Dave : well remember I was a union employee... UAW at that time
ME: UAW?
Dave : United Auto Workers
ME: and I did not know that you were in union
ME: ah, I see
Dave : I was working for Case in the factory in those days...
ME: Are you saying that non UAW members got less than UAWs?
Dave : if you worked in the factory in those days as an hourly employee, you had to be a union member...
ME: ah, ok
Dave : did the workers at McDonald's get that 4.20 per hour more, NO
ME: Well, the reason why I am asking you this question is...There was a strike of airline pilots in Korea
ME: There are two airline companies in Korea Korean Air, and Asiana...
ME: Asiana's pilots went on strike, and they became public enemy all of a sudden. People think, those pilots are not allowed to strike, as long as they earn more than ordinary Korean workers, and especially not on holiday seasons!
Dave : if they are unionized and not employed by the government of S. Korea, they certainly have the right to strike.... but in your culture, they are seen as greedy...
ME: That's the thing that I hate...They have every right, and people hate that...Their lame reason "for the sake of public and nation", my ass
Dave : for what sake of the public? and for the nation?? If everyone makes more, they spend more and more people work
ME: And Mass media started to use the anecdote of Reagan's firing aircontrol workers.
Dave : totally different situation
Dave : doubt if there are many reporters in the mass media in Korea who actually were living through those days here in the USA
ME: They said, "Look what Reagan did to those workers on Strike!"
Dave : well those workers worked for the federal government.. not a private company
ME: I don't think they lived through that period in the USA, they just read the news, I guess
Dave : and only selective parts of the news at that!
ME: yes, as usual
Dave : well, I need to do a few things... ttyl
ME: ttyl thanks
간략히 요점만 정리하면, 카터를 누르고 레이건이 승리한 이유는 국민이 원하는 "강한모습"으로 어필한 것이 크게 작용했다고 하네요. 또 당시의 경제상황이 심한 인플레로 몸살을 앓았나 봅니다.
그리고, 공항의 관제사들 파업에 대해선 이런 말을 하네요.
연방 직원인 공항 관제사들은 파업이 금지되어있는데(they were federal employees, barred from striking... ), 파업에 돌입했고, 그래서 다 해고를 당한거라고.
제가 짧게 아시아나 파일럿들의 파업에 대해, 그리고 국민의 반응을 말을 해 주었더니, 이렇게 답을 하더군요.
if they are unionized and not employed by the government of S. Korea, they certainly have the right to strike.... but in your culture, they are seen as greedy...
만약 노조조직이 있고, 한국정부에 고용된게 아니면, 분명히 파업할 권리가 있지, 그런데 니네 정서(culture를 이렇게 의역합니다.) 탐욕스럽게 보인거야.
그리고
totally different situation (전혀 다른 상황이지)"
저 개인적으로는, 공공이익을 위해서 파업을 자제해야 한다는 소리엔 콧방귀 뀝니다. 그 말은 "니네들에겐 파업할 권리가 없다"는 말을 두리뭉실 돌려 표현한 것에 지나지 않는다고 생각하고있습니다.
P.S 1 : 미국인들의 실질 소득이 하락하기는 엄청나게 하락 했나 보군요. Dave 가 과거에 자동차 공장에서 일할때 (80년대 초반) 인플레를 감안해서, 시급에 시간당 $4.20을 추가로 받았다고 하니...물론 노조가 있었기에 이것도 가능했나 봅니다. 지금 위스컨신주의 시간당 최저임금은 $5.70 입니다. 한국의 2배에 약간 못미치나요?
P.S 2 : Dave : the people like a strong leader, not a leader who is right....박정희나 전두환에 대한 향수를 설명할 수 있을까요?
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이번 BA의 파업에 대해서 언론이 어떻게 이야기할지 정말 기대(?)하고 있습니다.